Meghan Markle, the duchess of Sussex, talked ambition with tennis star Serena Williams in the first episode of her new podcast series, “Archetypes.”
The duchess invited Williams, who recently announced she’s “evolving away” from tennis, to discuss what Markle called “that dirty, dirty word when it comes to women — ambition.”
The 23-time Grand Slam champion discussed coverage that painted her behavior during matches as “a meltdown,” while a male player was called “passionate.”
“I just feel like there’s obviously a double standard,” Williams said.
“Often women are definitely put in these different boxes when we are ambitious or when we do have goals or when we reach our goals, it’s a negative connotation on how we reach the goals.”
The pair also discussed struggles with raising children in the public eye.
Meghan described an incident during which she says a nursery where her then-four-month-old son Archie was supposed to be sleeping caught fire while she and her husband were at an official engagement in South Africa.
“I’m standing on a tree stump and I’m giving this speech to women and girls, and we finish the engagement, we get in the car and they say there’s been a fire at the residence. What? There’s been a fire in the baby’s room.”
The fire was put out and Archie was unharmed, Meghan said, but she and her husband “still had to leave him and go do another official engagement.”
“The focus ends up being on how it looks instead of how it feels,” Meghan said.
When asked to define herself, Serena said, “I think above all, I’m just a mom. And I love being a mom.”
In a separate segment during the episode, Meghan also chatted about gender stereotypes and ambition in women with Laura Kray, a professor at the University of California, Berkeley.
“Archetypes” is a joint endeavor with Spotify and Archewell Audio, a production company owned by Meghan Markle and her husband, Prince Harry, that seeks to “investigate the labels that try to hold women back.”
The second episode, set for release next week, will feature singer Mariah Carey.
The duke and duchess entered into the exclusive partnership with Spotify back in 2020.
Former first lady Michelle Obama launched a Spotify podcast that same year, but the Obamas are reportedly looking for a new partner after Spotify declined to extend its deal with Higher Ground, the former first family’s production company.